Subaru Solterra Forum banner

The story behind the Solterra

5K views 31 replies 12 participants last post by  jg. 
#1 ·
#2 · (Edited by Moderator)
It's nice that he started out admitting the Solterra was nothing more than a "compliance car" at the beginning of development (or in product-speak, the "Minimum Viable Product" or MVP). In all the interviews I've seen of him, he's never admitted the company wasn't onboard with an electric car from the beginning. Also, they've had an electric vehicle on their corporate global website going back to 2014 when I bought a Crosstrek Hybrid, but this is the first we've heard anything about the timeframe of Solterra development with the quote, "...middle of the preliminary development of EVs in 2017." Really drives home how long they've been working on it.

For those that haven’t seen interviews with the product team, it’s clear they went “all in” and wanted a car that would perform as well or better than any of their existing models. I’m confident Subaru pushed Toyota much harder than they wanted in building their first (and probably in Toyota’s opinion their last) electric vehicle.
 
#4 · (Edited by Moderator)
I would suspect the overwhelming policy was to use everything possible out of the Toyota existing parts bins (because those have better availability in a Toyota factory).

As an example of (what I perceive as) the difference between Subaru and Toyota hardware, in the Wheel Hub Types thread you can see a huge difference between the capability and durability of the Subaru hub (first one) over the Toyota one (second one).

As stated many times on this forum by many people, solving the wheel recall "issue" is as easy as swapping out one hub type for another. So the extreme delay has to be management and strategic and not just engineering. Who knows what they are thinking. From all the snow testing product development videos in the mountains of northern Japan, all I can say is that it looks like Subaru did their part quite well.

It's clear Toyota was more interested in the Crown. It pisses me off they put a proper dashboard and center console design in the Crown and RZ450e, but had to screw around with conceptual designs from the Prius for the Solterra interior.
 
#7 ·
I would suspect the overwhelming policy was to use everything possible out of the Toyota existing parts bins. As an example of (what I perceive as) the difference between Subaru and Toyota hardware, in the Wheel Hub Types thread you can see a huge difference between the capability and durability of the Subaru hub (first one) over the Toyota one (second one). As stated many times on this forum by many people, solving the wheel recall "issue" is as easy as swapping out one hub type for another. So the extreme delay has to be management and strategic and not just engineering. Who knows what they are thinking. From all the snow testing product development videos in the snow in Japan, all I can say is that it looks like Subaru did their part quite well.

It's clear Toyota was more interested in the Crown. It pisses me off they put a proper dashboard and center console design in the Crown and RZ450e, but had to screw around with conceptual designs from the Prius for the Solterra interior.
Correct me if I am wrong, but the AWD system on the Solterra was developed by Subaru. Are the hubs not part of the drivetrain? Unless Toyota steamrolled Subaru into using Toyota parts, the AWD and bolt issues are on Subaru.
 
#10 ·
I agree - I have zero background in automotive testing or anything like that, but for an SUV that is inherently meant to go off-road and that will inevitably experience sudden braking unless you want to rear-end people have its wheels (potentially) fall off due to the stress of said off-roading and braking is asinine. There is more to it than just changing the bolts to a different spec, different alloy, whatever. Full disclosure - I canceled my Solterra order yesterday but placed a reservation on an ID4 six weeks ago. Looking at the ID4, it also uses lug bolts and it's a heavier vehicle due to the battery, just like the Solterra. I spoke to the dealer about the Solterra and he smiled, saying VW uses the same wheel design (and the ID4 can be had in AWD as well) but "our wheels don't fall off".
 
#15 ·
This is purely 3rd party (unverified opinion), Carl Tarum, he is automotive failure mechanism expert as per linkedin and had written this blurb which I accidentally came across...some food for thoughts:

Carl Tarum


If this were just a "torque to spec" issue, I think Toyota would have resolved it by now with a campaign to torque bolts to spec. Since the bZ4X has more mass than a Tacoma truck, I suspect that the forces on the wheel to rotor are higher than typical "car design". BEV also have a different torque/speed curve compared to ICE, which may aggravate issues. The fix may require a redesign including any of the following: class of threads, number of bolts, bolt circle diameter and tolerances, wheel flexural loads, thermal distortion, clamp load, etc. A design change will require re-validation, as well as getting part sourcing for new design and a plan to retrofit current vehicles. The fix may involve replacing rotors, wheels, and/or bolts, along with torque specifications. We have to wait for Toyota to resolve. They own the design, not us, and its not appropriate for us to conclude it is a "low bolt torque" or heavy vehicle issue. I just wanted people to be aware its probably not a simple torque adjustment issue.
 
#29 ·
Not a problem for me. I would like things to go a bit quicker, but because several people bailed, I am firmly on the list at my dealer. Its having a bit of a hard time with the wheel bolt nonsense but I am happy to wait until it gets here. I have a cherry 2019 BRZ with under 15,000 km on it to trade, our incentives are now up to 9 grand in BC, for low income people like me. However I am not poor and will just buy the car when its ready. Unless they give me 0 percent financing, which they will not. ;)
 
This is an older thread, you may not receive a response, and could be reviving an old thread. Please consider creating a new thread.
Top